FMLA

donicek

We have an employee who just started a 3 wk.work comp leave for a broken wrist.He is eligible for FMLA, but I am not sure if a broken bone falls under FMLA. Have any of you had this before and if so, did you offer FMLA? Thanks. Donice, Tampa

JM in ATL

If the broken bone limits a major life activity such as driving to work and working, it will qualify for FMLA.

Crout

I think JM is confusing FMLA with ADA, however, a broken wrist can fall under FMLA if it is deemed a "serious health condition," as defined in the regulations. The short answer is yes...a broken wrist would almost definitely qualify for FMLA.

Shadowfax

But FMLA is unpaid, he has a work comp injury. What's to decide?

Don D

It's the employer's decision whether to run these leaves concurrently. It can be mandatory. Whether paid or not, it can be both comp and FMLA. FMLA by law is called 'unpaid' because you DO NOT HAVE TO pay the ee while out. Doesn't mean he cannot be drawing a comp stipend.

The downside to this is that FMLA regulation prohibits you from requiring an employee to return to work on restricted duty, whereas comp typically suggests doing it. That's the only downside I know of to the concurrency. The upside is that it prevents the stacking of leave and comp and entitlement on top of each other.





**When we do for others what they should do for themselves, we disempower them.**

donicek

Our FMLA is unpaid and I know he will be paid for work comp, but I want to offer FMLA if it qualifies, so he does not have an additional 12 weeks. The doctor has stated that he cannot work. He has been on light duty for a couple of weeks, but just put the cast on. Thanks for the responses. Donice

Crout

I think you're quite correct to run the FMLA concurrent with his work comp for exactly the reason you stated: he could very easily stay out on work comp and THEN take FMLA. However, you must be careful in that there is a requirement to give the employee notice that you are doing so PRIOR to the beginning of the leave. Indeed, you have a requirement to post any policy effecting FMLA in your employee handbook (assuming you have one).

Down_the_Middle

donicek:
Don't lose sight of the fact that a simple fracture w/cast may not necessarily incapacitate the employee from doing the essential functions of their job...... It may be that the employee is truly unable to work, but presumably you'll get the necessary info on the medical cert form to ensure that this is the case.

stilldazed

We run the two concurrently if an employee is unable to work while recovering from OTJ injury. If the doctor certified that the employee is unable to work for a time that satisfies the FMLA definition, then FMLA can apply. As it turns out, my position happens to administer both. Unless I forget to remind myself, I generally don't have a communication issue between the two functions. Until recently, however, the function was split between two positions (someone else doing the W/C part), and I always seemed to be the last notified about a LOA, and then the notice was through payroll in a low work hours report.

There is one other downside to add to Don D's reference, one I haven't seen happen but believe must be an issue somewhere, which is that an employee could eventually be penalized under FMLA for having had a W/C absence when the two are run concurrently. The scenario that comes to mind is that of an employee who has a W/C absence to which FMLA is also applied. Later in the year, that same employee with no weeks or fewer than 12 weeks left has a personal medical reason for an absence, to which FMLA is also applied and that exhausts 12 FMLA weeks. However, in total for the second absence, less than 12 weeks elapse. A trigger happy supervisor who has an undercurrent of anger about the W/C incident jumps at the opportunity to fill the position before the employee on LOA returns to work, and waa laa, the employee doesn't have a job to return to, loses job and/or benefits, and has a history of an w/c absence that used up some of the FMLA weeks. I may just be an alarmist or focused on a potential exception, but that scenario sounds like a court case waiting to happen.

An upside to running the two concurrently is that getting medical certifications and RTW info is much easier in W/C. The employer has dialog with W/C insurance staff and medical providers, which is pretty much not allowed in non W/C situations.

pork1

DONICEK: Yes, broken bones can very well be an FMLA situation, as well as a W/C issue. Our company does not run them concurrently, however, we could simply by having our company policy stipulate that is our method of operation. You need only to notify the employee of the situation in written format with signature of acknowledgement or a mailed receipt return on file with your letter.

The broken bone situation depends on the physicians certification and our ability to accomodate any restricted duty stipulation.

In our world of work, one must "shower into the work site" and work in company uniforms, therefore, the cast on a limb must be portable or subject to being showered and sealed without breathing all day! We must protect our animals from the "nasty human life that we live". One can just imagine the germs stored inside a leg or arm cast, any of which if not dis-inflected daily, could develop and attack the herd, causing massive damage to the herd and profits. It is my role as the HR to protect the herd by handling W/C and FMLA cases, so that the operational folks do not have to worry with the issue.

Bottom line is to count on the physician's determination and if your company wants to count them concurrently, then notify the employee in writing of your count. As an FMLA make sure you notify the ee of the sunset of the last day of the 12th week. If your procedures call for the taking of sick and vacation time during the first 2 weeks, make sure that is covered and that you notify the W/C carrier of the payment for it might effect the start of STD with the carrier.

PORK

PORK

stilldazed

You must be making the rounds today.

The whole world economy looks a little more shakey to me now, and I'm not sure I want to keep the pork down that I had for lunch today. Somebody on the farm may not have had a removable cast.

Shadowfax

I must admit your post makes me a little more comfortable with your food product, especially given the recent discussion on 'mechanically separated' product. Not that I have ever given serious thought to not eating meat - when I left for the Air Force 42 years ago, myintent was to come home and raise hogs - but I have become more aware of what goes into, or on, some of our foods. As a kid we butchered on the barn floor and gave nary a thought to what gremlins might be lurking there,and I havn't been to a processing plant since I delivered my last animals there 40+ years ago. It's always interesting to see what kinds of problems, and solutions, other processes have. I think I'll have the 'other white' meat for dinner. (Sorry - no hijack intended, I just had a senior moment on the FMLA/WC interaction).

pork1

SHADOWFAX: Senior moments are authorized on this forum. We only kill on the Barn floor, when we are doing a C-section on a sow that has gone lame and not prime for market just to save the "piglets". Nothing wrong with the meat and locals charities will often be on site and the moment all of the baby "piglets" are pulled the charity will get the sow and into a locker somewhere for skinning and processing the meat for their personal charity's cooking.

PORK

Don D

[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 01-06-05 AT 02:42PM (CST)[/font][br][br]At the risk of cutting off the discussion of pulled piglets (I knew what pulled pork was), blood on the barn floor and charities waiting to haul off and skin a carcass, I would like to return to Stilldazed's (most confusing) scenario regarding the concurrency of leaves. I have reread it three times and cannot see any danger whatsoever in running concurrent FMLA when one is out on WC. If the employee has a WC incident and the employer runs it concurrently as FMLA (as we are entitled to do) and the employee later is found to be without any FMLA entitlement left, that's the breaks. There is nothing in the law that would preclude doing that. Every labor law seminar I have attended in the past eight years, in fact, has included a strong recommendation from the presenting attorneys to do just that. I do not think you will find an attorney anywhere who will recommend otherwise.



**When we do for others what they should do for themselves, we disempower them.**

stilldazed

Sorry for the confusion in the post and appreciate your input. There are a handful of forumites in whose responses I place a lot of value. Yours is among them.

What I described is not a scenario I have seen, just a recurring nightmare. My gut reaction agrees with your assertion about the breaks part. If my gut reaction is confirmed, maybe I won't have that nightmare tonight. The cagey side of me gets nervous about the what ifs, and my much shorter experience time line, nonetheless full, still leaves me standing in absolute amazement about what some employees will ask for and about what some supervisors will do. Part of the impetus for my turbo speed OTJ training has been the situations in which I had to come up with creative solutions to fix messes created by someone else and that left everyone feeling like they had had a win-win experience. I don't mean to make my position sound like it is not supported in my organization. It really is supported very well. Unfortunately, after 3.5 years I continue to reap the fruits of predecessors' labors--seeds of distrust, lack of interest, and incompetency. Even though my longevity has now surpassed many of my predecessors, old timers in our organization still have a tendency to see me as yet another passing fad in the HR function who is changing all the processes yet again, will probably go away soon, and they will summarize with something like, "She didn't know what she was doing either." Some days I am convinced I've worn out my welcome and should move on. It's Thursday, and it seems I've had three of those days already this week. Anyway, enough about that. I'm not one to cry much in public, but I do observe well, and my observation that a by product of high turn over in a key position is fragmentation and discontinuity--two of the worst evils for an HR function. And I think it must take twice as long to gather up the loose ends and get everyone back on one ship. If my projection is true, I have another 10+ years to go.

Pork, as far as the visual aids go, TMI for some of us general consumers. It's enough for me to know that everything's clean and nothing is wasted, which is what I already believed, and I'm an ex farm girl with lots of experience in many of the less than glamorous chores. For years I had my own rubber boots, bucket, and shovel, had to have my chores finished, and had to have had a shower to sanitize away the nasties before I woke my baby for breakfast--all in a prior life, before the nighmares started.