Plastic Surgery

Kayeh

Our sick leave policy states that sick leave is to be used when an employee is too sick to work. We have an employee that has asked off for 6 weeks for elective plastic surgery. Her request was turned down but she is now saying that we could only take a vacation day on the day of the surgery and after that she would be too sick to work so she wants her sick time used.

Has anyone had to address this issue?

LarryC

You have too much information, thanks to an employee who is forward enough and not aware of the privacy paranoia sweeping the nation.

If an employee comes to you and says they need 6 weeks of leave for medical reasons AND it is verified by her doctor, allow it.

Plus, if your policy states the sick leave is to be used when an employee is too sick to work and the doctor verifies that she is too sick to work, allow the sick leave.

That said, now I'm curious. What kind of plastic surgery puts you down for 6 weeks? I know that Lasik surgery and breast implants require a 4 day weekend. Just curious.

Kayeh

Tummy tuck and liposuction.

LarryC

Wow, I don't think even Michael Jackson was ever out for 6 weeks.

Kayeh

Our policy also limits the time off for sick leave as it is limited to the employee only. So, if an employee's child is ill it must be charged to vacation.

I do not think it is right for an employee to use their sick leave instead of vacation or unpaid leave for an elective procedure.

SandiF

Wow - we here on the left coast,(Washington), have always been able to use sick leave for the care of a child under the age of 18. I personally don't think this is a bad law.

Furthermore, a law was passed effective 1/1/03 which permits an employee to CHOOSE the TYPE of leave to use to care for a child with "a health condition that requires treatment or supervision," OR to care for a spouse, parent, parent-in-law, or grandparent that has a "serious health or emergency condition."

This doesn't necessarily bother me either; but it does show how employee-friendly this state is.
It hasn't been abused at our company.


Speaking of elective - isn't having a baby?

System

my former employer had a policy that stated sick leave (or short-term disability) could not be used for elective procedures. It was never questioned.
My current employer, though, states as long as we have a completed CHP from the physician then we should accept and move on.
I would require the CHP. I agree that this doesn't require 6 weeks recovery.

Yahoo

There is a "tummy-tuck" type of procedure that requires 6-8 weeks of recovery - gastric reduction. For those not familiar with the procedure, the doctor literally staples most of your stomach shut, so you get full with less food. This surgery is generally only done for those who are extremely obese, so it may or may not apply to your employee.

Frankly, if someone had just tucked my tummy & sucked out my thighs.......I think I'd want more than a 4-day weekend.

Kayeh

That is not the type of tummy tuck she is having.

rad

I'm looking into the "mini-tuck" - 7 inch hairline scar and back on my feet in no time!

Rockie

Another good argument for PTO instead of sick vs. vacation time. If an employee knows they have a bank of sick leave to use, they usually are not as judicious with what they use it for and how long they are out.

It's really up to the company what they will allow and disallow as "sick". Some companies are very generous. When my cousin lost her husband, her employer let her use her sick leave time instead of requiring vacation for bereavement type leave and it was several weeks.

In the case of FMLA, elective plastic surgery would not apply. One of the posters was correct in saying the employee only had to give a doctors' excuse that she was having surgery and would need to be out six weeks.

As far as "tummy tucks", this can be very extensive. In breast reconstruction after mastectomy, this type of procedure of often done to use the muscle and fat from the stomach to reconstruct a breast. There is an extensive incision with drainage (more than you wanted to know huh?). Liposuction isn't something with a long recovery period unless there are complications.

dynamite9551

our policy states they can only use paid leave to cover illness that would typically be covered by insurance, e.g. elective surgery such as costmetic is not covered by our group health therefore does not qualify for payment from sick leave or leave account.

costmetic surgery that is performed in relation to restruction due to injury or cancer, per se is covered.

dynamite9551

National Guard

One of the myths of plastic surgery is how easy it is to recover!! Especially with all the shows on TV nowadays people seem to think plastic surgery is a breeze when in fact it is NOT. Does 6 weeks sound like a long time to me? Sure it does! - but I am not a doctor nor have I ever had that kind of surgery.

Crout

If you end up allowing it as sick leave (and I agree with the poster who said that if she has documentation from her doctor stating that she needs 6 weeks to recover you should allow it, but only in the absence of a clear policy) don't forget to count it simultaneously as FMLA. You don't want to get in a position where she takes 6 weeks sick leave, then an additional 12 weeks of FMLA. But you need to tell her up front that you're counting the 6 weeks as part of her FMLA entitlement.

jrzgrl

Posted by Crout:
"...don't forget to count it simultaneously as FMLA."

Posted by Rockie:
"In the case of FMLA, elective plastic surgery would not apply. One of the posters was correct in saying the employee only had to give a doctors' excuse that she was having surgery and would need to be out six weeks."

?

Kayeh

Our policy states: Sick leave is intended to accomodate employees who are too ill to perform their assigned duties. An employee may be asked to present proof of illness.

Why would we not be safe in turning down this request since the employee stated that it is elective surgery.

Employee is also head of a department and taking six weeks off from work puts a burden on our company.

WO

I'm with Rockie, perfect example of why we should be moving away from sick leave to PTO. Let's start a national trend!

I was faced with a similar situation wherein an employee's spouse elected the popular laser eye surgery but was traveling to Canada to save money. Could have had the surgery locally. I did some calling around to various local clinics and determined the average length of absence necessary. The employee was then allowed 1.5 days of sick leave. The full day of surgery for care of spouse and .5 for doctor appt on the day prior to surgery. The employee was not happy.

WA state does have a new law allowing the choice of sick leave for spouse, parent, parent-in-law, grandparent and child under 18, vastly broadening the use of sick leave. And it is abused.

Go PTO.

HRGirl

My company has PTO, and everyone loves it. We also have no holiday time. We have flex time (true flex time, everyone has a key to the building and you can come and go as you please) so we did away with holiday's because half the people worked most of them. Every employee starts the company with 5 weeks vacation (3 weeks vacation and 2 weeks for the 10 yearly holidays).

As for the surgery, unless you have a policy stating that they can not use sick time or STD for elective surgeries, I think you'll have to allow it.

I know what it was like to have a c-section...I don't think a tummy tuck is much different (now I need the tummy tuck, I think the ob/gyn's and plastic surgeons are conspiring). I walked like a hunched over old lady for weeks all I was missing was the cane.

HRGddss

With the bariatric surgeries going on, how do you handle those? Our company's insurance does not cover them, but if someone is willing to pay 25K to get it, I think that the health benefits would be worth it. Certainly most MDs would agree. Your thoughts?