Reading & Writing English

Ranger

We hired a person for a forklift driver position. One qualification was the ability to become forklift certified and effectively operate the forklift. The person we hired never drove a forklift before (not a problem). This morning, he went through a hands-on test (after some training) and a written test. He failed the hands-on test (which we can accommodate with more training), but got every written test question wrong. The test is multiple choice and fairly easy and direct (e.g, how many people should be on the forklift at one time. He checked "as many as can fit"). To make a long story short, my assistant said the job posting doesn't include any wording about the ability to read, comprehend and write English. This new hire is Hmong and admitted to her he cannot read or write English. Verbally, he's fine. I told my assistant we must add this qualification to most job postings (not every job requires reading and/or writing English). Can any of you suggest some wording? Maybe something like "Ability to read, understand and write job instructions in English". I know we have to be careful because this requirement will have an adverse impact on Hmong and Hispanics.

Balloonman

Been there done that. You can give the test verbally and document the results and that is fine. I used to go around the training group and have each one read a quiz question. Then I got to the guy who could not read. Not good, I think I was more embarassed. The inability to read I have come around to realize over the years does not reflect on intelligence.
However that being said, the inability to read and write English, when it is a second language can create safety issues. No insightful wisdom, the ability to comprehend is the issue.........how do you verify comprehension? If you can do that you can deal with the lack of reading and limited English.
my $0.02 worth.
DJ The Balloonman

Don D

[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 09-05-03 AT 03:08PM (CST)[/font][p]Taking it a bit further, the ability to read and understand English can be critical. In our environment this impacts in the areas of written work instructions, safety notices and signage, emergency evacuation methodology, weekly and monthly training sheets, work routings and in some cases blueprints with legend and verbage. It is not possible to read these things to the ee in most cases and their inability to read them can seriously impact production and safety. Therefore, we do require the ability in some cases, regardless of adverse impact. Adverse impact is a given and employers are not required to institute measures to diminish that possibility. Looking down the road, we can expect that we will be required to reasonably accommodate applicants who have no English reading/writing ability.

(edit) I am just as sensitive as the next guy to the issues raised by this reality. I am also sensitive to the employer's bottom line and the employers business goals and objectives and its need to minimize cost and error at every turn.

gillian2

I don't think that we will be forced to make accomodations. I think that employers will start doing business differently, on their own, because that is the only way to adjust to a workforce which is changing dramatically. There will be some jobs where a requirement to read, speak and write English will remain and others where it will become less important because employers figure out how to get the job done with the employees that are available, many of whom do not speak English.

Pork

[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 09-08-03 AT 07:49AM (CST)[/font][p]YOU HAVE A RESPONSIBILITY TO HAVE A CERTIFIED FORKLIFT OPERATOR LICENSED AND DRIVING; NOT ONLY MUST HE/SHE KNOW THAT "ONLY THE DRIVER CAN BE ON THE FORKLIFT", UNLESS THE LIFT IS EQUIPED WITH A "MANLIFT", WHICH MAY ALLOW FOR MORE THAN ONE PERSON ON THE LIFT. HE/SHE MUST ALSO BE ABLE TO DO MATH AND DETERMINE THE LIFTING ABILITY FOR EACK LOAD, NOT JUST THE MAX LOAD LIMIT. YOUR SOLUTION IS TO CONTACT YOUR NEAREST LANGUAGE DEPARTMENT (school) TO HAVE THE TEST DEVELOPED INTO THE LANGUAGE OF THE EMPLOYEE APPLYING FOR THE POSITION. YOU COULD ALSO GET A LANGUAGE VERSION OF THE VIDEO TAPE THAT SUPPORTS THE FORKLIFT TRAINING. AFTER PROVIDING TRAINING IN AN APPROPRIATE LANGUAGE AND TESTING IN AN APPROPRIATE LANGUAGE TO FIT THE NEED, GIVEN HE/SHE PASSES THEN ISSUE THE DRIVER'S LICENSE AND HOPE FOR THE BEST; THIS IS ONE ACCIDENT, WHICH WILL BRING THE OSHA INSPECTOR TO LOOK AROUND THE FORKLIFT AND EVERYTHING IN VIEW! PORK

Don D

Very timely! We have a corporation wide requirement that no later than November 5, all employees desiring company group insurance, must provide to HR copies of marriage licenses, birth certificates, and proof of other coverage non-availablilty for their spouse. We are considering whether or not it will be necessary to pay an interpreter to come in and cover this with an employee who cannot read or write English and has very, very minimal English skills. We have no Spanish speaking staff on hand and this employee does not even speak Spanish, as I've reported before. He speaks some dialect peculiar to a region of South America - an unwritten, unpublished 'language'.

cebudragonlady

Don~
"Coverage non-availability" - what kind of proof are you asking for? And I would hope HR is not going to make/keep copies of all those licenses,birth certificates ! And gosh, who interviewed an employee who only knows an unknown language?

Chari

Don D

>Don~
>"Coverage non-availability" - what kind of proof are you asking for?
>And I would hope HR is not going to make/keep copies of all those
>licenses,birth certificates ! And gosh, who interviewed an employee
>who only knows an unknown language?
>
>Chari


Our corporation has a series of proof-forms, one of which is a certification of spousal coverage. If the spouse works and chooses not to take available coverage there as primary but instead elects to join our plan, there is one rate (really high). If the spouse works but has no coverage available there, then they can take ours as primary with minimal cost. If the spouse does not work, there is minimal cost if he/she joins our plan. In the case where the spouse does work, the other employer must complete a portion of the proof-form. We are also eliminating the $50 OPT-OUT election that we have been paying people who opt out of coverage altogether. Obviously this is a good business practice attempt to keep people off our plan who do have available, adequate coverage elsewhere as well as those who have no business being on our plan in the first place. And YES, our department now has to view (upon hire) birth certificates and marriage licenses for all persons wanting plan enrollment, and file them. We are doing this as a one-time thing next month for all current employees nationwide and we will have to file those for internal audit as well. The corporation has conservatively estimated that this will save us 1.3 million dollars per annum in medical costs (just the dependency proof part of it). Company's have for years done this with dependents in college and those of a certain age in college who should roll off the plans. We have decided to take it a giant step further in the interest of bottom line savings. Besides, I had an empty file cabinet.

Leslie

We require birth certificates and marriage licenses at hire. But what do you do about divorce decrees? We had an employee hired 04/99. She comes up last month with a marriage license to another employee. We say, gee, you already have a husband on the plan. Oh, I'm divorced. She comes back with a decree dated 10/99...and of course the ex has been using the plan. Then we talk to the employee she married and tell him he still has a wife listed on the plan - he needs to show us a divorce decree. He can't. So she's fired for insurance fraud and is married to a bigamist. Oh, he's gone also for failing to provide appropriate documentation to verify eligibility. My.

System

A couple of thoughts. We don't have a requirement that a person be able to speak/read/write English, but I wish we did. A big priority for us is safety, so even a productive, skilled employee who is unable to read warning signs or attend safety orientations in English is a liability. We offer bilingual training, and it helps, but we can usually have to team these guys with bilingual workers. Keep in mind that Hispanics tend to be distrustful, and they tell me it is because their government is so corrupt that authority figures are not viewed positively. Because they want to avoid being noticed many of them won't speak English even if they can. Over time they realize that our company is supportive and the rules apply to everyone, and that helps them overcome shyness and distrust. The majority of the guys haven't made it past the sixth grade, so they aren't literate in their own language. Difficult situation! But I don't think the requirement is discriminatory: people need to be able to communicate independently, and safety is a prime example of that need.
I'm glad this thread came up, because I suggested an audit of the dependents on our dental and health insurance - rumors have reached me about certain employees being unmarried, but they claim wives and children on their insurance. There are others who have tried to insure nieces and nephews, but the birthdates or names gave it away. I think we're losing a lot of money!

Don D

I forgot to mention: Along with the notorized affidavit the employee signs, for those situations involving grandchildren, nephews and others, we also require a copy of a birth certificate and the court order that placed the dependent in the employees custody or made him/her 51% responsible. We have many employees who say, "Hey, you know Johnny I take care of Johnny since his momma doesn't work. He needs to be on my insurance". In the series of presentations I had two weeks ago, rolling this requirement out, one of my favorite guys in the plant raised his hand, grinned and asked, "Does this mean I can't have my uncle on here no more?"

The stance of the corporate office on this was and is, "We are not going to be bashful about this. This is an opportunity to save this company millions of dollars in medical/pharmacy costs that we should never have been paying in the first place."

Pork

DON: IT IS ALSO TRUE FOR THOSE OF US WHO ARE SELF INSURED, IT IS, FOR THE MOST PART, THAT THE DEPENDENTS SERVICED RATHER THAN THE EMPLOYEE SERVICED THAT DRIVES THE COST OF MEDICAL INSURANCE COVERAGE UP! Last year we lower the cost of premiums to the employee to $12.00 per week and $41.50 per week to the family and we raised the deductable to $300.00 per member covered & we added a drug benefit. Those that use the plan, which comes from the bottom line yearly are first paying the deductable, which has helped everyone in lowering their cost of the premium paid. Approximately, 67% never make a claim over the $300.00 deductable.

I wish the owners of my company would agree to a 100% audit of the enrollees! From this posting I am going to push for a audit and proof of family membership IAW our plan document. This posting alone may even pay for my membership to this very fine HR Club!!!

PORK

Pork

LindaD: I have found that most foreign nationals enrolled with our company made claim on their W-4 of marriage and numerous children in order to lower the income tax hit. The more dependents the less we take per week and the more the treasury builds because these individuals are now "confessed illegals", whith whom we are supporting to get a status change. They never submit income tax claims, because they know the name & SSN are false. They make more money in a week, than they could make in 3 months at home, therefore, the cost of taxes doesn't bother them and they still have cash to send home! Be careful not to stereotype them in negative terms, for they work circles around the typical young US citizen workforce.

PORK

Don D

Pork, my dear neighbor and colleague: You spent the better part of a very long paragraph stereotyping "most of our foreign nationals" as form-fakers, confessed illegals and tax cheats. Then you concluded by saying don't stereotype them in negative terms. Maybe I'll get another cup of coffee and reread it.

Pork

"DANDY DON": I do not consider it to be stereotyping, when one has the facts, You see we also have 3 foreign nationals that are legal and they are also a part of this particular group of workers. Put lots of sugar in your cup of coffee for you need to be very sweet to day, someone may come to find you to hug your sweet MIssissippi, Grandmaw beeded neck! OH AND GOOD MORNING DON IT IS TIME TO GO TO WORK, I CAN'T BELIEVE HOW MUCH TIME YOU HAVE ON YOUR HANDS IN THIS NEW JOB OF YOURS, YOU MUST HAVE TWO COMPUTERS IN YOUR OFFICE AND ON YOUR LAP, OR ELSE YOU MUST HAVE A GREAT NEW STAFF THAT TAKES CARE OF THINGS WHY YOU RESPOND TO THESE WONDERFUL AND LEARNED POSTINGS!!!!!!!!

While you are at it go to Hardees and get one of those biscuits, PORK, and jelly morning sandwiches. They are oh so good!

PORK