Protest

Don D · September 2002

I want to go on record as protesting the non-posting of the credentials of people whose names are adjoined to those big, bold colorful logos that indicate they are editorial or legal staff affiliated with HR Hero. It would be real nice to know who these folks are and from whence they speak. Most of them have blocked profiles. What's up with that? x:-)

System · September 2002

Don, are you stirring up trouble again on the eve of my vacation? x}> You realize if the stress levels are too high, I might have to stay at the beach and absolve myself of forum and website duty forever. The aforesaid people who are responding without inserting their credentials (altho there shouldn't be very many whose profiles are blocked) are the attorneys who write the Employment Law Letters in each state. It may have something to do with the fact that when they agreed to help monitor the forum, I told them, "Now be afraid ... be very afraid of one particular poster - his screen name is Don D and once he gets a hold of you, you'll never be the same." :-S

Really, though, you've asked a good question, Don, and there are a couple of reasons some of them may be leary about listing that information.

First, some state bar associations limit attorneys on solicitations. For example, some states allow them to note their law firm name but they cannot say "Contact me for more information." Other state bar associations may limit or ban solicitations but not come right out and say what they consider to be unlawful soliciations, so the attorney has to make a judgment call on what he or she can list on the forum posts. Of course, the safest thing to do if you aren't sure is leave it blank.

Second, some attorneys are concerned about giving "advice" over the Internet to people with whom they don't have an attorney/client relationship. They're happy to help out with suggestions and note what the law says on a topic, but they are concerned that people will use their posts and name or law firm name as bona fide legal advice ... which [i]would[/i] be very unwise on the part of the employer.

I'm sure other attorneys out there can add to my "lay person's" explanation, but that is how I understand it. I'd rather have their help and posts without the credentials than not have their help at all. And I respect the fact that they are trying to abide by their state bar association rules. However, maybe some who CAN post their credentials (name, law firm name, newsletter name, etc.) without violating any rules will start to do so as they can.

Christy Reeder
Website Managing Editor
[url]www.HRhero.com[/url]

Don D · September 2002

That makes sense and I certainly had not thought about it from that perspective. So, I can understand not posting their law degrees; but, they could at least add some aura of 'realness' to their profile....like: collects cherry pits or has world record for consecutive belches. Hey, even you and Margaret did it and made it a better place. Speaking of which, has Santire left the building. I enjoyed his advice.

sonny · September 2002

Have a great a vacation, you'll be missed. Am afraid if that baby is a girl, you may have to name her Helga.. hopefully she will move on quickly.

System · September 2002

sonny:

Groan!!! #-o I was close - if the tropical depression turns into a hurricane, it will be named Hanna. We won't get there until Sunday ... maybe the worst will be past by then. xpray

Christy Reeder
Website Managing Editor
[url]www.HRhero.com[/url]

NaeNae55 · September 2002

Have a good vacation. I do think it's a good idea to get some input on baby names from forum members. We could even vote on names. Of course, the final decision would belong to you and the new father, but hey! What fun!

Don D · September 2002

Christy: I've been wondering how your husband communicates with you since you so often talk in emoticons. Come back rested. We will wear you out.

sonny · September 2002

You are right and Hanna would be a better name than Helga. Latest reports are that at least here on the East coast, the worst will be over by Sunday. .until then 70% of rain. You should get some good weather by next week. Enjoy! There are some COOL lighthouses over there if you are in to that!

Margaret Morford · September 2002

Don D,

I just returned from working with a client to find your e-mail. While I filled out my profile, I'm perfectly willing to post my rather checkered professional past for you to view. Here's the bio you wanted:

Margaret Morford is President for theHRedge, Inc., a national management consulting and training company. Her clients include Lockheed Martin, Home and Garden Television, U.S. Marine Corps, Northwestern Mutual Life Insurance Company, The Nashville Predators (national hockey franchise), BorgWarner, Brunos Grocery Chain and the U. S. Naval Nuclear Submarine Group. Previous to owning her own company, Margaret was Sr. Vice President, Human Resources Consulting for Martin/Frankel, a national consulting firm out of Winston-Salem, North Carolina. She has a BS degree from the University of Alabama and a JD degree from the Vanderbilt University School of Law. She has worked as an attorney, specializing in employment law as well as been the Vice President of Human Resources for three large companies. She is the author of the video “Running With the Big Dogs – How to Make HR a Strategic Player.”

That's all the scandal and smutt I'm willing to share with you!

Margaret Morford
theHRedge
615-371-8200
[email]mmorford@mleesmith.com[/email]
[url]http://www.thehredge.net[/url]

Don D · September 2002

Thanks Margaret. But, you know who I'm talking about. The attorneys who suddenly pop up answering every question authoritatively with all the legal mumbo jumbo preaching that is not always readily useable by us. It's much easier and beneficial to engage in people-speak with common sense and not get mired in case law and chastisements from the folks the HREdge has just signed on to edit state newsletters. NowhatImean? Not fussing, it's just that sometimes we (I) wonder who are these guys anyway who throw books at us. Have any of these guys ever worked a day in a real HR world besides you? If I come across that way, I want somebody to tell me to tone it down. I've got a great sense of humor and sometimes get carried away with what I've experienced in Hr over the past 103 years, but, I am no authority on anything other than frying turkeys and building bottle trees. Now, I've vented. It's Saturday afternoon and I'm going out back to work on a bottle tree and have a beer and grill stuffed porkchops. Have a good one. Don D x:-)

YadaYada · September 2002

I have to disagree, Don D! You might appreciate these legal eagles a little more if you ended up needing one to help you win an employment case. And no, I'm not an attorney, but I think they are doing what they are best at - telling us what the law says, how the courts have interpreted it, and what is the safest course to take to avoid getting our hind quarters in hot water. If we choose not to follow their advice, that's our business ... and in fact, that's how they (the good guys that are trying to help us by writing the letters) make a living - helping those of us who don't follow their advice and end up slapped with a lawsuit. Think about it ... how professional would it be for you as an HR manager to tell your employees 'well, that's what the company policy says, but really, this is REAL life, and that policy just doesn't seem reasonable in your case.' The rule's the rule, and that's what they're supposed to tell us. Anything else would be unprofessional.

That's my opinion for what it's worth.

Don D · September 2002

Perhaps I miscommunicated my concerns. I appreciate very much all the legal guidance we can get to help us operate more compliantly. It's all a matter of APPROACH. It's the sudden authoritative, almost belittling, commentary that I find offensive. We are not, after all, a classroom full of 101 freshmen here and I don't think what we really benefit most from is having it suggested "Here, let me show you how stupid you are". On the other hand, perhaps I am misreading these guys. I'm open to considering either. By the way, yadayada, I tend to bounce almost everything off our company attorneys if it has any degree of legal implication.

sonny · September 2002

Fully preparing myself for a lashing. . .what is a bottle tree??

Don D · September 2002

Knowing I'll be criticized for posting it here, I will anyway. It's folk art way out in the back yard, unobtrusive, not near neighbors, something halfway between crazy and magical and yes, I cleared it with the wife first (but would have done it without consent). I wrestled a 350 pound, dead, floating cypress out of the reservoir, took it home in a truck, dug a 3 foot hole and cemented it upright. It stands 13 feet high and is about the circumference of a basketball. It's sand colored, weathered beautifully, no limbs, slick as a table top with beautiful grain, knots, holes and texture. Next I drilled 40 holes in it at a downward 45 degree angle and inserted 8 inch pvc pipe pegs spray painted the exact color of the tree. These pegs are randomly placed all over the tree. With a little help from my friends and after a few visits to the whiskey store, I have a brilliant colored glass bottle on each peg...red, orange, green, gold, burnt orange, brown, clear, and every shade of blue. It can be seen from several rooms on the back of the house and from the street if you stop and look through the fig trees. At high noon when the sun pounds straight down on it, it's therapeutic. Bottle trees, I'm told, date back a hundred years, but none quite this complex. I've also just done one with a two-inch-square, black fence post, 10 feet high, perfectly proportionate (totally unlike the other one) with eighteen precisely positioned cobalt blue quart bottles. I am looking for a small weathervane to position on top of it if you have one. O=*

System · September 2002

Don
Not wanting to offend you, but after reading about your bottle tree, I might want to re-think wanting to be marooned on an island with you. x:D
However, I do agree with your comment on some of the posts from a few unknown experts. I too have been in HR for more years than I admit to and sometimes find their responses a little belittling. It is easier to take a suggestion if I know the person has some real background on the subject, or has "been there".

Don D · September 2002

Don't you know that if I can convince my other household members that a backyard bottle tree is a good idea, I will certainly be an asset on a desert island. After you think about it, I'll be glad to take your order for your tree. I require mileage and per diem. x:-)

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