Compulsive Gambler

TMorche · July 2004

We have an employee that we suspect (are 99.9% sure) is a compulsive gambler. He rents an office from us, and runs his own computer system seperate from our network.

We need the money at this point for his rent, and cannot kick him out. We omitted the suggested policy on gambling in the employee handbook - sort of due to this guy, because like I said before, we need the money and sales he produces.

I am wondering if anyone has any stories about compulsive gamblers at their workplace, how they handled or approached the issue, its results, and when they considered it really out of hand.

I do not want to endanger anyone at our location due to this guys habits, and am not sure what the dangers are of allowing it to go on. We have witnesses who have seen his notes to self on improving his Poker playing, actually seen him online playing online games (Poker, which he admitted to them - but said he was simply watching), and he keeps very LONG and strange hours including weekends, early morning, and late evenings - none of which are required or normal for our office.

My objective in approaching him would be to guide him to getting help - however I do not know if he'll be receptive. We offer EAP where he could get 3 sessions, but I know that isn't enough.

What do you think? I'm sure this isn't a new problem - any insights would be appreciated!

Don D · July 2004

since our state brought in casinos ten years ago, gambling (gaming) locations up and down the MS River, on the Gulf Coast and at the Indian reservation have grown by leaps and bounds. We probably have 25 or so now and are arguably second only to Vegas. Along with it all, of course, has come quite a few downsides, one of which you address. I had an employee at my last job who went straight to Vicksburg and hit the gambling boats every payday, without passing go, without going home, and spent his whole paycheck, every week. When he started reporting tardy on Mondays, I learned of his behavior. I asked if his wife was aware and he said, "Hell, she goes with me and takes her check too." I eventually turned them in to Human Services because they were leaving three small children at home alone all weekend, day and night. He eventually self destructed, got heavy into pain medication and was terminated. You asked for stories and this is a true one. I don't really have any advice for you. But, good luck.

Crout · July 2004

You never made clear what his performace issues are. Is he often tardy or absent? I get the impression that he is in sales and that he is doing well...is that correct? You mentioned that he is flexing his time...is that allowed? Is he violating your internet policy by playing poker on-line? You have to focus on his behavior at work and judge him by those standards.

TMorche · July 2004

We are not trying to judge him or discipline him at this time. We are only concerned for him personally and the possible safety of our workers - if there is even a threat.

He is in sales, and he is exempt - or at least right now he is exempt - all depends on if we have to change that to follow the DOL regs. At this point we do not care if he works 1 or 80 hours...

Crout · July 2004

>We are not trying to judge him or discipline him
>at this time. We are only concerned for him
>personally and the possible safety of our
>workers - if there is even a threat.

Of course you're judging him. Unless he came to you and admitted up-front that he has a gambling problem, you have formed a judgement that he does...in fact you're 99% certain of it. marc has clarified my confusion as to his status, and I think he has a very valid point. If you're renting him his work space, and he can set his own hours, he looks like a contractor to me. I'm also not sure what the safety issues are.

rad · July 2004

As for safety - if he's borrowing money from loan sharks and two thick necked leg breakers show up at the door with baseball bats, call the police. I can't think of any other safety issues. When its time to renew his lease and/or contract, you've got to decide whats more important...an employee who delivers or someone who is on the road to self destruction. From your post it appears that you knew about his problem before hand and purposely left out your gambling policy, thereby painting yourself into a corner (did I understand that right?).

We have a very strict gambling policy - do it on company time or using company resources - phone, computer, and yes, employees have done it - corporate card, you're terminated.

TMorche · July 2004

Thanks Rad. Appreciate your input. I thought of the leg breakers, but I guess that is the extent of it huh? I guess besides that it is a self destructive problem.... Too bad.

marc · July 2004

I think you may have more than an ER/EE relationship since you are renting him an office. Is he also renting the equipment in the office, the phone service and the internet service? My point is that you also have a commercial relationhip of some sort that may have a huge bearing on how you treat this guy. Lots of sales people are really independent contractors and as such, you may not have the black and white ER/EE relationship. Thus your handbook and other policy's may not clearly apply.

TMorche · July 2004

I appreciate your concern. He is an employee of our company, who works as our sales representative and represents us. He is a "branch manager" out of our space. We've already gone over this with our accoutants and lawyers.

As far as judging him, we are only looking to help him or give him so alternatives. I suppose this may not even be our place, I was just looking for some advice or other peoples encounters/experiences in this area. This was the first place I was trying to look to see what people do/have done.

Thanks for your input. I'm looking more for some stories and not a definitive answer to my problem. Sorry to confuse the issue.

marc · July 2004

Your lawyers and accts have blessed this as an ER/EE relationship, but I am still confused. My father-in-law was a successful life insurance salesperson and with all of the mergers and acquisitions ended up as an independent contractor with the same office in the company that he always had. Except he became an independent contractor, rented his office and all the goodies in it and also began directly paying his secretary. He still had to abide by certain aspects of the ERs policies and procedures but now was an independent contractor and what he did on his computer and in his office and the hours he set were all up to him. I thought perhaps your situation was more like that.

I have a couple of tragic stories about gambling compulsion, but they are not ER/EE stories, just stories about people and the ruin thier gambling habits brought to their lives and the lives of those around them. It can have absolutely horrible results. Intervention is a tricky thing and I salute your desire to help the guy. In NV, there are regular public service announcements giving a phone number for people to call that believe they have a gambling problem. Perhaps your state has a similar service?

TMorche · July 2004

Marc-

Housing and Urban Control (HUD) forces us to make our sales people employees, Loan Officers, we are a mortgage broker in Michigan. It is actually illegal for them not to be... The question is really that age old exempt or non-exempt - but that's a whole differnt issue.

We recently have gotten casinos and legalized gambling in our state, so there are programs out there. I will look into it.

The more I brainstorm about this, I am thinking that passing some literature out to ALL EMPLOYEES might be a way to impact even just one, without singling him out. (Or at least trying to do that) I think that might be what I do.

rad · July 2004

While you're at it, see if some gambling agency like Gamblers Anonymous has those rip-off take-one information post card things you can hang in the restrooms. We keep domestic violence assistance numbers on those cards in the restrooms so employees have the privacy to make that first step to getting help if thats how they want to do it.

TMorche · July 2004

That's a great idea! Thanks! I will look into it.

GJohnson · July 2004

We had an employee with a gambling problem and did not become aware of it until it was "too late".......meaning that she embezzled a very substantial amount of money over a lengthly period of time to fund her habit.

It came to our attention when she called in sick, then wouldn't return phone calls, nor would her family give us information. When we went through her desk, there was evidence to point to a gambling problem. Living in Las Vegas, we knew she played from time to time as she did some major home improvements after a "large win".

It took us nearly a year to put together a case and have her prosecuted. She recently was released from a 5 year prison term.

She was able to cover up her thefts for a lengthy period of time as we were sadly understaffed, and we were experiencing tremendous growth. Like the party you mentioned, she often showed up at the office at odd hours - checking on things - or maybe being sure that she wasn't being checked up on herself. We had regular audits - and she was able to prevent suspisions from the auditors. In retrospect, her behavior should have been a tip off. At the time I often worked on weekends just to keep up (as I am exempt). Often she would stop in and say that "She saw my car outside" and would use that as her excuse for being in the office. Ocassionally I would show up and find that she was here. I always got some excuse to justify her being on property, sometimes claiming to be doing something "personal" on the internet etc.

Had we been more aware, we would have tried to get her some assistance. As a result, we have some of the strictest audit controls around now. Our honest, hard working staff, and those hired since, still have to deal with the hard feeling from members that "we took their money". Although I was not at the trial, I was told that she was unaware of how much money she had taken. She was truely surprised. In investigating we found that she used multiple methods to cover her tracks, and that the thefts were small at first and escallated over time to a point that she could no longer cover her activities.

Needless to say, the loss of trust has taken years to repair. Her family has been devastated. Our staff was close to her and her family. Many of the staff felt betrayed.

I wish you luck in working with this person. Your short term gain (of the rental space) may not exceed your long term losses with this individual.

TMorche · July 2004

Thank you so much for your story. I didn't consider the fact that he could be stealing money in some way, since we try so hard to be honest in our business and personal practices.

In our industry, it is possible that situations could come up where he got paid instead of us - even though that would be wrong. I will have to keep an eye on him. Maybe we'll look through his office, we are allowed to do that.

Thank you for your insight - it is greatly appreciated. You are correct though, the long term effects could be much worse then the short term gains. Thanks again.

Compulsive Gambler

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