Funeral Leave Question

LindaS · December 2003

We are a union facility and have a funeral leave policy in our contract that allows for three paid days off for the planning and/or arranging of certain family members funerals. I have an employee whose mother passed away last Thursday, the funeral was scheduled for Saturday but Saturday AM the employee's brother passed away as well. The family is now having a double funeral for the two.

In your opinion would the employee be granted sixe days off (three for each) or just the three? This may seem petty to some of you but when you have a union facility you always have to keep in mind that once you do for one, you have to do for all and we want to be sure we make the right decision.

Thanks for your help.

Whatever · December 2003

The key here is the exact wording in the contract. Therefore, I would need it in order to answer your question.

mushroomHR · December 2003

Our policy states that multiple deaths does not broaden the number of days allowed. Therefore, our employee under these circumstances would only be allowed the three days of funeral leave if the funerals are on the same day.

Don D · December 2003

Your contract no doubt will NOT address the situation of multiple deaths or same day funerals. I'm sure the wording will obligate you to grant three days of leave for each death. The last contract I worked with stated, 'Three days including the day of the funeral', then listed the eligible relatives. That sort of wording could somewhat limit the number of days granted in this scenario.

HS · December 2003

In the interest of compassion, I personally would grant the person the six days (and have them request personal time if they needed more). I could not imagine have just 3 days to recover from losing a mother and a brother in so short a time frame, regardless of if the funerals were at the same time or not.

It truly does depend on the exact wording of your contract, but I tend to err on the side of compassion with an issue like this. Not to be macabre, but if this employee's brother had died the day of the mother's funeral (or anytime after), the employee would have gotten the 3 days in addition to the 3 days for the mother.

Our policy does not specify what the time is to be used for, just that the employee is granted up to 3 days off upon the death of an immediate family member, or 1 day off for those not in the immediate family. So according to our policy, again, I would grant 6 days.

Shawn · December 2003

The leave is typically for grieving, as opposed to funeral arrangements. 6 days seems reasonable given the mom and brother. Of course, I would give more sick & vacation time off if requested.

SDDCHR · December 2003

HS said it best. This is a tuff time for this employee and on the side of compassion, give the 6 days. I would even take a look at the wording and change it to reflect this.

Beave · December 2003

The above answers have me wondering what to do in a worst case ... Recently, I heard of a fire in which six family members died. If the employee was entitled to 3 days each, would you still grant eighteen work days off to that employee?

safety · December 2003

Yes.

HRICA · December 2003

Me too.

psrcello · December 2003

I agree! Contract notwithstanding, I can't imagine denying three days of bereavement leave for each of the employee's deceased family members. It's difficult enough to deal with the death of a loved one without the added burden of feeling pressured to get back to work or lose pay.

HS · December 2003

It's as I said earlier, err on the side of compassion. Put yourself in that employees shoes. You just lost most, if not your entire family in a fire (and you may be the only survivor). Your boss tells you, "sorry, since you lost them all at the same time and will have the funeral the same day, you get 3 days off." Sounds heartless, doesn't it?

Regardless of if they all die at the same time, or at varied times throughout their employment, it should be 3 days for each. Sorry to say, but I can't beleive this is even a question in people's minds. Has all the compassion for our fellow man(and woman) gone out of the workplace? Tis a sad day indeed if the question is answered with a yes. I personally would think twice about staying at a corporation that showed little or no compassion, especially in the scenarios presented here.

Whatever · December 2003

The issue is not one of compassion. Of course, all of us want to be compassionate. The issue is the union. With our union, whenever we have shown compassion it has come back to haunt us.

Don D · December 2003

I'm a more compassionate person than the Forum will ever know; however, having said that, Human Resources decisions can't be made with emotion or compassion as the PRIMARY determinant.

I don't mean to suggest those things should be absent from our departments and it's often tough to make the hard decisions that seem to make us appear heartless. This is a general thought and has no particular relation to the funeral question in the variety of scenarios this thread presents.

I suggest first we must follow policy, assuming there is clear policy. If policy allows flexibility, then I suggest we should be flexible within reason, analyzing precedent and consistency. And lastly, if there is no policy, we must act consistently, but only after carefully thinking through the possible consequences. And somewhere in each of those is room for compassion, which is surely secondary to our stewardship over the company's policies and interests.

HS · December 2003

I agree Don. Not all decisions are easy ones, but if we follow the policy, consistently every time, there shouldn't be any problems. The toughest decisions that we have made (i.e. terming someone around a holiday), will tug at the proverbial heart strings even though the term is warranted. The day I don't feel that compassion and the tough decisions become routine without weighing heavily upon me, is the day I don't want to do this job anymore.

With that said, in my previous post, I was purely speaking regarding the funeral situations presented. I cannot imagine any employer not "bending the rules" in certain tragic situations; as long as they did that for everyone. It is not very often that we'd have to come across scenarios presented here (thankfully!).

LindaS · December 2003

Thank you to all of you for your responses and, while I agree with HS regarding compassion, please keep in mind that we are a union facility and need to go according to our current collective bargaining agreement. In reading the contract it states that the time off is specifically for arranging for and attending the funeral. It also goes on to state that the purpose of this paid leave is for funeral related purposes. I guess I answered my own question, huh?

From a compassion standpoint, I am not against providing the employee additional unpaid time off to deal with his grief but the paid time needs to be done in accordance with the contract.

Don D · December 2003

Linda: Leaving the compassion discussion for awhile, I think you'll agree that the clause in your contract is perhaps antiquated and at best, poorly worded. We've had length discussions on the Forum about those who do and don't attend funerals. It's also a fact that when some people die, there is no funeral. In those instances, your policy would not even allow the approval of paid leave. It is also a fact that not every immediate family member is involved in funeral preparation plans (thank goodness) and not all family members go to the funeral. It would be a good idea to pencil in that clause on the list of things that need dressing-up in upcoming contract negotiations. You could appear to offer a give and take at the table if you were to clear up the number of days off and at the same time delete the unworkable language about preparation for and attending the funeral.

LindaS · December 2003

Don: Your suggestions are duly noted and I agree with the outdatedness of the wording in the contract. We just completed our contract negotiations and the only issue regarding the funeral leave that was addressed was the request from the union to add "memorial service" to the wording for paid leave (we have granted paid leave for memorial services the same as funerals). Since we only have a one-year contract, this is probably something that will come up next year so we'll wait and see.

Thanks for the suggestion.

HS · December 2003

As I said in post #4, it depends on the exact wording of your policy or contract. Yes, you have answered your own question. Don is right, you should look at updating this policy in the future.

Funeral Leave Question

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